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Post by Angel on May 2, 2009 21:59:21 GMT -5
TLDR ok listen the whole gay marrige thing is so f**k**g stupid ok staight people dont want 2 men or 2 women to get stupid and gays want it. ok its a straight tradition not a gay tradition. marridge is for A Man and a Woman in love to come togethet and MAKE A BABY and not 2 men or 2 women, im not gay bashing its not the same thing who says it they cant make new tradition or something. for real im sorry. and f**k**g straight people make a big deal over something so stupid its f**k**g rediculis. really am i the only one who thinks this is stupid? Umm.. judging by the other posts in here.. you could have easily answered that question. -_- It's the problem when you "TLDR;" you look foolish. xD |
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ManOfSteele
Member
[M:-10000]
The Original
Posts: 2,695
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Post by ManOfSteele on May 2, 2009 22:17:00 GMT -5
What? Steele has an opinion on this? ZOMG!
Personally, I'm neutral for it, but I sway towards being for it.
I've always been taught that people are who they are, and that no matter what they look like, what they do, what they say, who they like, ANYTHING they are all human beings that have reals human emotions and should be treated equally.
The one thing that makes me so infuriated is when priests or pastors tell people that they can't have something, or they'll go to hell JUST BECAUSE they have different beliefs, or are gay, or choose not to come to church, or whatever.
God is supposed to love every single one us us, right down to the very core. Why would this magnificent loving God who loves all no matter what, only accept certain people JUST because of their beliefs? If he made us to be all different, why would he only accept people with good BELIEFS?
On the other hand, I also believe that marriage is a sacred bond between a man and a woman. However, if two gay people who truly love each other wanna get married, they have way way more right to be together than the 50% of couples who will get a divorce later in life. I value true happiness over material possession and or sex.
I'm not against it, but I'm not for it. If you waled up to me and asked me if I had a problem with gay marriage, I would say no. I have no problem with it. I cannot change other people's beliefs, and by denying people what they want, you'll only make them want it more (HEAR THIS CATHOLIC CHURCH!?).
Am I gay? No. I'm not gonna get a gay marriage, but I could care less about what other people think and wanna do, and there's nothing I can do about it.
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Post by starprincess on May 2, 2009 22:19:16 GMT -5
What? Steele has an opinion on this? ZOMG! Personally, I'm neutral for it, but I sway towards being for it. I've always been taught that people are who they are, and that no matter what they look like, what they do, what they say, who they like, ANYTHING they are all human beings that have reals human emotions and should be treated equally. The one thing that makes me so infuriated is when priests or pastors tell people that they can't have something, or they'll go to hell JUST BECAUSE they have different beliefs, or are gay, or choose not to come to church, or whatever. God is supposed to love every single one us us, right down to the very core. Why would this magnificent loving God who loves all no matter what, only accept certain people JUST because of their beliefs? If he made us to be all different, why would he only accept people with good BELIEFS? On the other hand, I also believe that marriage is a sacred bond between a man and a woman. However, if two gay people who truly love each other wanna get married, they have way way more right to be together than the 50% of couples who will get a divorce later in life. I value true happiness over material possession and or sex. I'm not against it, but I'm not for it. If you waled up to me and asked me if I had a problem with gay marriage, I would say no. I have no problem with it. I cannot change other people's beliefs, and by denying people what they want, you'll only make them want it more (HEAR THIS CATHOLIC CHURCH!?). Am I gay? No. I'm not gonna get a gay marriage, but I could care less about what other people think and wanna do, and there's nothing I can do about it. I'm for it and Steele pretty much said most of my points, so I'll let him continue talking. ;D |
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ManOfSteele
Member
[M:-10000]
The Original
Posts: 2,695
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Post by ManOfSteele on May 2, 2009 22:20:29 GMT -5
What? Steele has an opinion on this? ZOMG! Personally, I'm neutral for it, but I sway towards being for it. I've always been taught that people are who they are, and that no matter what they look like, what they do, what they say, who they like, ANYTHING they are all human beings that have reals human emotions and should be treated equally. The one thing that makes me so infuriated is when priests or pastors tell people that they can't have something, or they'll go to hell JUST BECAUSE they have different beliefs, or are gay, or choose not to come to church, or whatever. God is supposed to love every single one us us, right down to the very core. Why would this magnificent loving God who loves all no matter what, only accept certain people JUST because of their beliefs? If he made us to be all different, why would he only accept people with good BELIEFS? On the other hand, I also believe that marriage is a sacred bond between a man and a woman. However, if two gay people who truly love each other wanna get married, they have way way more right to be together than the 50% of couples who will get a divorce later in life. I value true happiness over material possession and or sex. I'm not against it, but I'm not for it. If you waled up to me and asked me if I had a problem with gay marriage, I would say no. I have no problem with it. I cannot change other people's beliefs, and by denying people what they want, you'll only make them want it more (HEAR THIS CATHOLIC CHURCH!?). Am I gay? No. I'm not gonna get a gay marriage, but I could care less about what other people think and wanna do, and there's nothing I can do about it. I'm for it and Steele pretty much said most of my points, so I'll let him continue talking. ;D  Star and I agree on something! YES!!! It's a miracle! I'm gonna start a count. So far this is 1 for 1 |
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Post by rebirth on May 2, 2009 22:45:41 GMT -5
What? Steele has an opinion on this? ZOMG! Personally, I'm neutral for it, but I sway towards being for it. I've always been taught that people are who they are, and that no matter what they look like, what they do, what they say, who they like, ANYTHING they are all human beings that have reals human emotions and should be treated equally. The one thing that makes me so infuriated is when priests or pastors tell people that they can't have something, or they'll go to hell JUST BECAUSE they have different beliefs, or are gay, or choose not to come to church, or whatever. God is supposed to love every single one us us, right down to the very core. Why would this magnificent loving God who loves all no matter what, only accept certain people JUST because of their beliefs? If he made us to be all different, why would he only accept people with good BELIEFS? On the other hand, I also believe that marriage is a sacred bond between a man and a woman. However, if two gay people who truly love each other wanna get married, they have way way more right to be together than the 50% of couples who will get a divorce later in life. I value true happiness over material possession and or sex. I'm not against it, but I'm not for it. If you waled up to me and asked me if I had a problem with gay marriage, I would say no. I have no problem with it. I cannot change other people's beliefs, and by denying people what they want, you'll only make them want it more (HEAR THIS CATHOLIC CHURCH!?). Am I gay? No. I'm not gonna get a gay marriage, but I could care less about what other people think and wanna do, and there's nothing I can do about it. I agree with everything but that one bit about marriage between a man and a woman bit. i believe (and it is my belief) that marriage is the bonding of two souls, rather than be just between a man and a woman. |
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Post by eiron on May 2, 2009 23:40:35 GMT -5
What's more oppresive than laws saying you can't love someone? Not the fine print, but it sure is the message behind it. Let them get married if they want to.
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Post by ness11 on May 3, 2009 20:03:03 GMT -5
50 for, 50 against.
Honestly don't really care, I mean to be honest if you have a public gay marriage it really only gets yourself setup to be mocked, but they probably know that ahead of time. It really doesn't do much harm, then again what do I know considering I live in Ohio --no gay marriages permitted.
I honestly don't really care.
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Jesus
Member
[M:0]
Im jesus. K?
Posts: 489
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Post by Jesus on May 5, 2009 15:49:53 GMT -5
marrige is a state of mind and paper held by a ring making BABAS IS CALLED SEXY LOVEY FAWK TIME  im completly for gay marriage. |
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Post by bobsnicket on May 5, 2009 17:33:51 GMT -5
Everyone can believe what they want to believe. However, I say no to legalized gay marriage for two reasons.
1. The government IS seperate from church and beliefs. Therefore, their definition of marriage should be in accordance with the denotated meaning of the word, which IS between husband and wife, man and woman (see the dictionary). No other way is fair. It's not right to change the meaning of a word in favor of one's own beliefs.
2. I do not see homosexual couples as a problem to anyone else except for one thing. I have a problem with adopted children being forced to be raised by parents of the same gender. That's not fair to them.
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Post by Angel on May 5, 2009 17:38:28 GMT -5
Ooohh.. I have to respond to this one.. this one is basically a go on me, someone how wants nothing more than to adopt a child... but will end up with that exact same situation.. raising a child with two parents of the same gender.
I want to hear exactly why this is a problem! Gender is nothing but stereotypical crap. A man should be able to be and do anything that a woman is, and vise versa. There is no difference when it comes to heart and love. Things like "having a male role-model" and having a "female role-model" are things that make me angry. You shouldn't have to be any one way.
In my house, there will be no concept of gender roles and forcing a child to behave in any one way. A human being should get to be exactly who they are inside and out.
I'm sorry.. but.. I have to say this. I've dreamt of having a child since I was one myself,, and being told that I shouldn't get to have that joy is horrible.
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Post by rebirth on May 5, 2009 17:39:51 GMT -5
Everyone can believe what they want to believe. However, I say no to legalized gay marriage for two reasons. 1. The government IS seperate from church and beliefs. Therefore, their definition of marriage should be in accordance with the denotated meaning of the word, which IS between husband and wife, man and woman (see the dictionary). No other way is fair. It's not right to change the meaning of a word in favor of one's own beliefs. 2. I do not see homosexual couples as a problem to anyone else except for one thing. I have a problem with adopted children being forced to be raised by parents of the same gender. That's not fair to them. I can understand the first part but in a way the second part is kind of offensive. I same gender parents can raise kids just as good "hetero" parents can. In fact there are studies on such a topic as well. But further more, it shouldn't matter if you are gay or straight, rather it should matter if you are loving, caring, compassionate enough to raise a child with the proper care that he/she may need. I agree whole-heartily to this^ |
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Post by bobsnicket on May 5, 2009 18:02:39 GMT -5
Well, the simple truth is, the only way to bear a child is with opposite genders. If people don't like that, they shouldn't take it up with the government, of all things. The government can't change facts of life.
I do not profess to understand homosexuals and therefore don't have any feelings against them. I respect their rights as human beings to be able to have the same opportunities as everyone else. But another fact is that no matter how hard a couple can try, it's impossible to raise a child and keep them completely oblivious to the differences between male and female. You have to teach them to use the right bathroom. You have to teach them that there are things that are appropriate to say and do around boys that aren't polite around girls, and visa versa. A child can be raised by wolves, but he/she will still inevitably discover that they are not a wolf (the animal used was irrelevant, only an example). I think it would be wise to think of what the child would want rather than just oneself; it's probably fair to say that most children would want to grow up under normal circumstances. Like divorces, this is something government cannot control. But the human rights thing kind of turns on itself here.
Point is, gender is no stereotype; it's a biological and anatomical fact of life. It's wrong to give one gender rights the other doesn't have, of course, but those against gay marriage aren't doing that. We've had racism and women's rights in the past, but those aren't the same because it was about one group having less rights than another. Without gay marriage, everyone still has the same rights. Anyone can be married. "Marriage" in the dictionary means between husband and wife. The dictionary is not biased, unlike any particular group of people.
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Post by Angel on May 5, 2009 18:16:11 GMT -5
Well, the simple truth is, the only way to bear a child is with opposite genders. If people don't like that, they shouldn't take it up with the government, of all things. The government can't change facts of life. I do not profess to understand homosexuals and therefore don't have any feelings against them. I respect their rights as human beings to be able to have the same opportunities as everyone else. But another fact is that no matter how hard a couple can try, it's impossible to raise a child and keep them completely oblivious to the differences between male and female. You have to teach them to use the right bathroom. You have to teach them that there are things that are appropriate to say and do around boys that aren't polite around girls, and visa versa. A child can be raised by wolves, but he/she will still inevitably discover that they are not a wolf (the animal used was irrelevant, only an example). I think it would be wise to think of what the child would want rather than just oneself; it's probably fair to say that most children would want to grow up under normal circumstances. Like divorces, this is something government cannot control. But the human rights thing kind of turns on itself here. Point is, gender is no stereotype; it's a biological and anatomical fact of life. It's wrong to give one gender rights the other doesn't have, of course, but those against gay marriage aren't doing that. We've had racism and women's rights in the past, but those aren't the same because it was about one group having less rights than another. Without gay marriage, everyone still has the same rights. Anyone can be married. "Marriage" in the dictionary means between husband and wife. The dictionary is not biased, unlike any particular group of people. On the first thing, that is not true. Cockroach females for instance can create babies without male influence in times of great need. There are always exceptions to nature, and life can sadly, even if some people find it unnatural and wrong, be artificially created. In my opinion, a child that is sitting in a adoption center just wants to be loved... a child is not judging of who loves them one bit. Gender does not equal sex. I am a girl. I am a woman, I am female gendered. I have the common sense to tell my child, "Don't flash yourself in public." "Wait until you've commited yourself before having sex." I know exactly tell me son that they need to control themselves in public, and I can tell my child that she shouldn't inform everyone when she is on her monthly cycle. It's common sense, and I can be there and help. (I've always been against premarital sex.) But I want to raise my child, and let them know they can be whoever they want to be. Just because your a boy doesn't mean you can't be mothering, sweet, shy, sensitive, loving, feminine. And just because your a girl doesn't mean you can be a strong, sturdy, protective provider. These are stereotypes based on they way people always have just assumed there to be. I want to tell them that even if people don't like it.. they are born with beautiful wings of their own special color. .and NO one should be able to keep them from being all they want to be. Gender and sex are not the same thing... they are not. If my male sexed child wants to run around in beautiful pink dresses and play with dolls.. then that's who he is. No one should tell that child that just because other people think that he is bad, that he isn't. Being yourself is not wrong. As I said before in my post, I am not against marriage staying between a man and a woman. In fact, I agree with you.. as long as homosexuals get equal rights with whatever union they get. I fight for the rights, not for the word. |
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Post by rebirth on May 5, 2009 18:49:31 GMT -5
Well, the simple truth is, the only way to bear a child is with opposite genders. If people don't like that, they shouldn't take it up with the government, of all things. The government can't change facts of life. I do not profess to understand homosexuals and therefore don't have any feelings against them. I respect their rights as human beings to be able to have the same opportunities as everyone else. But another fact is that no matter how hard a couple can try, it's impossible to raise a child and keep them completely oblivious to the differences between male and female. You have to teach them to use the right bathroom. You have to teach them that there are things that are appropriate to say and do around boys that aren't polite around girls, and visa versa. A child can be raised by wolves, but he/she will still inevitably discover that they are not a wolf (the animal used was irrelevant, only an example). I think it would be wise to think of what the child would want rather than just oneself; it's probably fair to say that most children would want to grow up under normal circumstances. Like divorces, this is something government cannot control. But the human rights thing kind of turns on itself here. Point is, gender is no stereotype; it's a biological and anatomical fact of life. It's wrong to give one gender rights the other doesn't have, of course, but those against gay marriage aren't doing that. We've had racism and women's rights in the past, but those aren't the same because it was about one group having less rights than another. Without gay marriage, everyone still has the same rights. Anyone can be married. "Marriage" in the dictionary means between husband and wife. The dictionary is not biased, unlike any particular group of people. That's where your wrong. Look at the benefits of marriage Rights and benefits
* Right to many of ex- or late spouse's benefits, including:
o Social Security pension
o veteran's pensions, indemnity compensation for service-connected deaths, medical care, and nursing home care, right to burial in veterans' cemeteries, educational assistance, and housing
o survivor benefits for federal employees
o survivor benefits for spouses of longshoremen, harbor workers, railroad workers
o additional benefits to spouses of coal miners who die of black lung disease
o $100,000 to spouse of any public safety officer killed in the line of duty
o continuation of employer-sponsored health benefits
o renewal and termination rights to spouse's copyrights on death of spouse
o continued water rights of spouse in some circumstances
o payment of wages and workers compensation benefits after worker death
o making, revoking, and objecting to post-mortem anatomical gifts
* Right to benefits while married:
o employment assistance and transitional services for spouses of members being separated from military service; continued commissary privileges
o per diem payment to spouse for federal civil service employees when relocating
o Indian Health Service care for spouses of Native Americans (in some circumstances)
o sponsor husband/wife for immigration benefits
* Larger benefits under some programs if married, including:
o veteran's disability
o Supplemental Security Income
o disability payments for federal employees
o medicaid
o property tax exemption for homes of totally disabled veterans
o income tax deductions, credits, rates exemption, and estimates
* Joint and family-related rights:
o joint filing of bankruptcy permitted
o joint parenting rights, such as access to children's school records
o family visitation rights for the spouse and non-biological children, such as to visit a spouse in a hospital or prison
o next-of-kin status for emergency medical decisions or filing wrongful death claims
o custodial rights to children, shared property, child support, and alimony after divorce
o domestic violence intervention
o access to "family only" services, such as reduced rate memberships to clubs & organizations or residency in certain neighborhoods
* Preferential hiring for spouses of veterans in government jobs
* Tax-free transfer of property between spouses (including on death) and exemption from "due-on-sale" clauses.
* Special consideration to spouses of citizens and resident aliens
* Spouse's flower sales count towards meeting the eligibility for Fresh Cut Flowers and Fresh Cut Greens Promotion and Information Act
* Threats against spouses of various federal employees is a federal crime
* Right to continue living on land purchased from spouse by National Park Service when easement granted to spouse
* Court notice of probate proceedings
* Domestic violence protection orders
* Existing homestead lease continuation of rights
* Regulation of condominium sales to owner-occupants exemption
* Funeral and bereavement leave
* Joint adoption and foster care
* Joint tax filing
* Insurance licenses, coverage, eligibility, and benefits organization of mutual benefits society
* Legal status with stepchildren
* Making spousal medical decisions
* Spousal non-resident tuition deferential waiver
* Permission to make funeral arrangements for a deceased spouse, including burial or cremation
* Right of survivorship of custodial trust
* Right to change surname upon marriage
* Right to enter into prenuptial agreement
* Right to inheritance of property
* Spousal privilege in court cases (the marital confidences privilege and the spousal testimonial privilege)A laundry list of benefits that straight couples can have but not gay couples? Now look at what same-sex couples have to face: * potential loss of couple's home from medical expenses of one partner caring for another gravely ill one
* costs of supporting two households, travel, or emigration out of the U.S. for an American citizen unable to legally marry a non-US citizen
* higher cost of purchasing private insurance for partner and children if company is not one of 18% that offer domestic partner benefits
* higher taxes: unlike a company's contribution to an employee's spouse's health insurance, domestic partner benefits are taxed as additional compensation
* legal costs associated with obtaining domestic partner documents to gain some of the power of attorney, health care decision-making, and inheritance rights granted through legal marriage
* higher health costs associated with lack of insurance and preventative care: 20% of same-sex couples have a member who is uninsured compared to 10% of married opposite-sex couples
* current tax law allows a spouse to inherit an unlimited amount from the deceased without incurring an estate tax but an unmarried partner would have to pay the estate tax on the inheritance from her/his partner
* same-sex couples are not eligible to file jointly or separately as a married couple and thus cannot take the advantages of lower tax rates when the individual income of the partners differs significantlyLook at all this? Tell me, really are same-sex couples are getting tried equally if they don't have the right to marriage? I can care less about the definition of marriage, care you forget that like most things in these world definitions change . The word gay used to: having or showing a merry, lively mood: gay spirits; gay music. Now it also refers to homosexuality. |
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Post by bobsnicket on May 5, 2009 19:26:15 GMT -5
Well, you've all made your points, and I've made mine. I didn't post here to start an argument, just to express my opinion. So that's all I have to say.  |
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Star and I agree on something! YES!!! It's a miracle!
